removing free action/ free living potions.

[Whizz]

Yes. Clearly. You have no idea what the fuck I'm talking about.

Even you have no idea what the fuck you're talking about. Way to be clueless and biased.

[Teddey]

I am comparing professions to professions. If you're farming mats for one, why not for the other?

[Deems]

Because executioner doesn't make you immune to all snares and stuns for 30 seconds. Use your brains.

[Cube]

No on needs max alchemy. You just need Journeyman level alchemy. Which frankly you can easily hard grind in a day, stretch it even to two.

That's true. Still applies, not even near the percent of the player base ran around with journeyman Alchemy farming an endless amount of FAPs. Why? Because there was shitloads of other stuff to keep you occupied. You needed you ratings, needed to sort alts, weekly raids, reputations, farm honor etc. In this system it worked fine, on SF where everyone who has a profession has Alchemy and on top of that free access to unlimited mats. I'll just stop there because I think you get the point, at least hope you do.

Second, on an earlier post you said only locks & priests are QQing to keep the potion. On the other hand, the majority of players saying they want it removed are rogues and maybe mages. Truth is something could trash the balance of the game, but as long as it isn't affecting you, you wouldn't give a shit. & I'm not pointing any fingers here, not saying You in particular, it's just fact. Everyone will want something that will benefit their class in some way.

No. I said the majority, not only. And as for what I said, that was the whole point. You say 9/10 players who wants it removed are classes that gets screwed by FAPs, I say 9/10 of the classes who doesn't want it removed are the ones who doesn't get screwed by FAPs. See what I did back there?

& to clarify, I'm fine with Cube's mat suggestion. Make it like retail. Fine. I don't mind farming mats.

But then make it like that for all profs. You can't possibly suggest that it should be ONLY for FaP. That's just stupid then.

Have I said anything other than that for this whole discussion?

& frankly this could even BENEFIT rogues/mages more than many other classes.

This could be said about all flag-carriers. Some classes do it better than others though, has nothing to do with FAPs. This has to do with class abilities which we want functional. This has also been one of the main points of this discussion. Turn your example around the other way though and you have class abilities (some more than others) that gets useless because a flag carrier used a potion that he can use for his next flagrun times the amount of free mats he can get a hold of. The problem here is really Rogue and Mage flag runners... mhm.

& yes, I"m sure you see this potion used more here than on retail/Blizzlike servers. But that's obviously going to be the case. & why does that only apply to FaP? How many people did you see on retail using Noggenfogger + Flask of Pure Death/Relentless Assault + Wizard Oil + Well Fed food in every BG? Was every single warrior or rogue running around with Execuctioner enchants on their weapons? Did every lock and mage have Soulfrost or Sunfire?

Noggenfogger, yes. Executioner, yes. Soulfrost/Sunfire gives +10 more spelldamage to said schools, but removes spelldamage from other minor schools. In other words doesn't do any differance what so ever, just looks cool. So might as well say yes on that as well.

As for the rest, no. So please make the mats farmable/limited.

Asking us to farm for mats for one potion only is unfair. Asking us to farm mats from one prof is unfair. You'd have to apply it to every profession. That means enchanting as well. Imagine having to do that ourselves? Instances would have to be run. Heroics would have to be scripted, then run. This is a PvP server. Hence the ease-of-access to such things.

I don't know where you have pulled the idea that we're just talking about FAPs and not engineering/alchemy in general from. I really don't. But as I said, that's not the case. As for the other professions, quite frankly I don't give a shit since they're not really screwing pvp over. But sure. If that's what has to be done to make alchemy/engineering mats farmable, then I'm 100% fine with that.

Edit: And please edit your damn posts, a pain to have a discussion with you when one reply is five posts.

[Firstaidkit]

Did you whine just as much on retail as you did here? Or did you never play retail?

No I didn't because everyone and their mother didn't run around with max Alchemy and unlimited mats, so you didn't really see it as much as you do here. And I've already stated that this is the problem, not FAP's in themselves (even though they're probably one of the strongest profession toys around pvp-wise). If you're gonna reply at least read the damn posts here first.

And as for me playing on retail or not, how is this relevant when we're talking about professions on a private server? I mean really? You're making a lot of sense.

You don't even need max. Alchemy to make FAP's only like journeyman skill and I would actually farm all of the materials daily on my alt if I could annoy people like you with it. And you were the one starting to talk about people never using it on retail so I just asked if you ever played retail, because I'm pretty sure they're were people that used FAP's on retail.

[Amgseret]

I dont remember Cube saying FAP wasnt used on retail. Just you cant compare the amount of FAP spam here to retail. (because of the limitation his named) Often just flug runner popped it once in 1 of 10 wsgs.

ps: Executioner is overrated

[Whizz]

If anyone is eager to use the retail argument why don't we just make profession rates 1x and make you farm the materials?

[Firstaidkit]

With your logic.... Mass Dispel should be disabled because removing good useful effects is stupid. Paladin bubble should not be possible to remove at all. Just deal with it? Paladin bubbles should now be 30 seconds as well since 12 is not enough. Fear, Howl of Terror, etc, and all rogue CCs should be disabled because there's pointless.

That is what the potion does essentially, for too long of an amount of time. Renders Medallion of the Alliance/Horde pointless, allows for an additional trinket to have an advantage over a lot of players, etc. Without a mats limitation, we're missing the limitation that prevents this potion from becoming abused. This potion doesn't allow classes to function properly at all. Yes, we all hate rogues, yes they're OP a lot of the time, but that's how they work. You're taking away their class abilities. Like I said, it's like allowing paladin's to have their bubble longer, and your Mass Dispel disabled. You wouldn't like that would you?

Don't disable FAP then because it's part of the game as well (unlimited or not).

[Deems]

Good idea FAK. Lets add back everything that is "part of the game."

Remove instant 70 so we have to level. Its a part of the game right?

[Whizz]

Do I remember FAK crying about flask of petrification and how you called it "abuse" even though it was a part of the game and working as intented? Fucking hypocrite.