Server Ultimatum Suggestion.

[Rawrza]

except, custom items wont ever happen

Probably not, but I still haven't heard why they're bad from someone who can make a decent point.

Custom gears will ruin everything : / .

EDIT: ask to yourself, Why others TBC serves died?. Because they added custom gears .
People just came TBC to play like TBC ,not shit custom items.

Why will they ruin everything, exactly? Especially if it's just a tabard or shirt. I'd love to hear this, because nobody else can tell me.

"Shit custom items" do kill servers. Thank goodness I don't make shit custom items.

If you'd just used the search engine, you'd notice theres dozen suggestions like this and Henhouse has given all of them the same answer: NO.

That's what I've been told. I'm going to again reestablish that it was only an example of things that are possible to do. Still, for the third time in this post and the thousandth time in this thread, nobody can tell me why a well-made custom item is bad. Probably because they've never seen one, which I can understand. I've probably seen as many poorly-made custom items as everyone else here, so I know where you're all coming from.

I developed custom gear and quests (among a boatload of other things) for smaller servers (except for Chronic WoW which was pretty big) so I'm not surprised that people haven't seen my work.

I also know it's probably not going to happen, especially with the members of the community (at least the ones who have responded) so vehemently up in arms without ever even seeing a proposed piece of gear or at least trying the gear themselves. It honestly comes off as closed minded or trying to impress Henhouse by repeating his response to other (probably stupid) propositions when he hasn't gotten around to responding to this one yet. Let the man speak for himself, for goodness sake.

So far the response has been a very hostile no with zero reasons as to why. I've never encountered a situation like this where nobody can actually make a point. I know I'm probably making a lot of people dislike me, but gauging from what I'm seeing the people who have responded are simply incapable of normal discussion and instead of providing points supporting their side of the argument they'd rather be hostile and unpleasant.

Let's talk like grown-ups from here on out, please.

[Mynce]

That's what I've been told. I'm going to again reestablish that it was only an example of things that are possible to do. Still, for the third time in this post and the thousandth time in this thread, nobody can tell me why a well-made custom item is bad.

because even though a custom item can be well made it was never intended to be in the game.
if blizzard wanted tabards with stats they would have done so a long time ago.
theres 1 tabard with some use effect but thats it.
also, its been proven on many servers that it just doesnt work well for the population.
infact it will probably backfire since people hate the custom items based on there experience.

it is this what cube didnt feel like telling you because it was kinda obvious from all the responses you got so far.
Granted. your effort is appreciated, it just isnt put to good use for this server thats all.
i assume that you've noticed that the server is having allot of bugs.
i think it would be greatly appreciated if you would be able to participate on that.

Let's talk like grown-ups from here on out, please.

Lets be honest now.... have you seen the ingame chat?
have you seen the topics around here?
yea... exactly.
you cannot expect that every person here is gonna respond mature.
but most of the response here arent even that childish imo.

[Rawrza]

because even though a custom item can be well made it was never intended to be in the game.
if blizzard wanted tabards with stats they would have done so a long time ago.
theres 1 tabard with some use effect but thats it.

I'm also pretty sure Blizzard didn't intend for Hyjal to be used in 2.4.3 (since it has a lot of invisible walls and such, even in the unmodified version), for us to start out at level 70, and for there to be malls in Tanaris (also in an area you're not supposed to reach) and Shattrath. That argument simply does not work. There is already plenty of non-Blizzlike elements on this server. Know what? I don't think that's a bad thing. Why should we stick with what we have when we can expand on it and it (*GASP*) might just turn out good if we give it a shot?

also, its been proven on many servers that it just doesnt work well for the population.
infact it will probably backfire since people hate the custom items based on there experience.

I don't understand why someone would hate something they haven't even seen yet. Those servers were ruined by the kind of items I specifically try not to create. I've stated several times I know that the ball has been dropped by developer and developer when it comes to custom content. I did it early on when I first started as well. The difference is I learned what I was doing.

it is this what cube didnt feel like telling you because it was kinda obvious from all the responses you got so far.
Granted. your effort is appreciated, it just isnt put to good use for this server thats all.
i assume that you've noticed that the server is having allot of bugs.
i think it would be greatly appreciated if you would be able to participate on that.

I appreciate you trying to explain the hatred of the concept, but honestly it simply does not make sense to me why someone would be so against something they've never even experienced. All custom items are not created equally, by any means. Closed-mindedness is what kills servers more often than custom items.

Lets be honest now.... have you seen the ingame chat?
have you seen the topics around here?
yea... exactly.
you cannot expect that every person here is gonna respond mature.
but most of the response here arent even that childish imo.

Yes, I have seen in-game chat. I myself have done a little trash talking but it's all in jest. I've also seen some people who seem pretty serious about what they're saying on there too. It seems the most stupid people are often the most vocal.

You're right, it was silly of me to expect that but I at least expect better than I've gotten. Sure, they haven't been as childish as in-game chat but the blatant hostility in their responses was totally unwarranted especially when, as I've said before, there's really nothing they've seen yet for them to hate.

To reiterate, closed-mindedness is what kills servers more often than custom items.

[Cube]

You can design a custom tabard, or shirt however you'd like, it would still breed more problems than it would solve, balance wise that is. TBC is known as the expansion where the skill of the player often outweighs the gear of the opponent, at least to some extent. This was true for retail, not so much on Smolderforge. Problem around here is that every donor (which is quite a few, if you haven't noticed) is running around in pretty much bis SWP gear. What does this do, balance wise? Well, first of the offensive aspect of gearing totally rapes the defensive aspect. TBC was already a fast paced expansion to begin with, compared to later expansions, SWP gear adds quite a lot to that. It makes offensive stats more valued than defensive ones.

On top of this, gear scaling in TBC (or wow in general) is screwed up. Warriors and Rogues for example, get way more out of their main stats than most other classes do. SWP gear introduced haste stacking, which makes casters around here pretty damn insane. And this is in an expansion where haste obviously wasn't taken into account when it comes to pvp. In retail, this wasn't much of a problem, here it is.

So why not add defensive stats to said tabard/shirt/whatever? That would solve quite a lot, right? No. Just as with offensive stats, certain classes scale better with defensive stats. We don't really need to make Resto Druids harder to kill, now do we?

And we haven't even started to talk about the balance difference between the classes. Sub Rogues for example, that scale incredibly well with gear, and are way over the top mechanic wise. What do you think would happen if they got a hold of more stats, on top of their bis BT/SWP gear? And Resto Druids, as I mentioned before, you really want to increase their effective healing?

But then again, we could just skip adding extra stats, and start to design different gear pieces. Why? What could this possibly add to the game? More versatility? Not really, and if so it would just give people more options to make their setups even more overpowered. I don't really think more of that will add more good than bad, in any way.

And have you taken the people that come here to play TBC into account? I know quite a lot of them around here, and some are already put off by the SWP gear. What do you think their reaction would be when they log on their character just to see a bunch of custom gear around? Looking at it the other way, people who actually like custom gear most likely won't be scared away by the lack of it.

And saying that since Hyjal is working as custom content, obviously custom gear will as well, that's just wrong in every possible way. Hyjal doesn't interfare with any balance mechanics in the game, neither does the mall or any other custom content you might find around here. Stats on the other hand does.

And as you say, you've already heard it, and people have already stated it, including myself, the answer has already been given. No. This might be a private funserver, but it's still a TBC server.

Quests, "world" pvp zones like Hyjal, or other similar custom content is fine. Custom gear is not.

[Rawrza]

I can understand your point, now that one has been made. Thank god.

I just wanted someone to be able to make a point. My side of the debate wasn't even that important to me.

I suppose we could give like a BoJ or something as a reward for something a custom quest line. I'd like to have the chance to run a concept for one by Henhouse to see what he thinks.

[Kaloyo]

I'm still not with you on custom items as the replies of others have stated why :p.
But I'm just curious, what kind of "balanced custom item" would you offer?
(Just list stuff).

[Deems]

Give us an example of a custom item

[Rawrza]

It could literally be as simple as a tabard with a bonus gem slot and/or maybe a little Staminia or Resilience. Something everyone can use so not one class specifically gets too buffed by it. Just a reward for completing some custom objective, like a quest or couple of quests for example.

The idea of custom items in this discussion started out literally as me saying it as an example of sometihng that's possible for us to do, lol. I didn't have anything specific in mind but I mean as long as it's tastefully done it wont hurt anything.

[Xaru]

Give us an example of a custom item

What if the GMs made special reskinned S4 helmets for donators during seasonal holidays? For instance at christmas you open a special donator present that has a chance of giving you a reskinned s4 helmet that's a santa hat. Or at Halloween when you kill the special boss he'd have a chance of dropping a S4 halloween helmet. I think it would be really fun and everyone would enjoy it. But I know it won't happen.

Also, I have no idea what they were talking about. I just wanted to contribute. :(

[Rawrza]

But I know it won't happen.

I could make it happen. The boss would have to be scripted by someone else, but this is the sort of thing I love to do. I think it would suck pretty hard if it was donors only though, so I'd figure something out.